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	<title>Comments on: Zlatan Meanwhile, is Saying at Least Vaguely Nice Things</title>
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		<title>By: Ruby</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25382</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 21:51:22 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>MAD, I can see we are never going to see eye-to-eye on this one *grins* - and I do realise that I am one lone, hopelessly naive/idealistic/outdated/whatever voice in the midst of the money-driven world of modern football.  World&#039;s getting smaller, and all that jazz.  Doesn&#039;t help that I&#039;ve been re-reading a lot about Superga recently; when clubs &lt;i&gt;were&lt;/i&gt; pretty much wholly made up of nationals.

I dunno, it just makes me a little sad, I suppose.  Mind you, not enough to send Kaka/Pato/Gourcuff/Seedorf back whence they came... ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MAD, I can see we are never going to see eye-to-eye on this one *grins* &#8211; and I do realise that I am one lone, hopelessly naive/idealistic/outdated/whatever voice in the midst of the money-driven world of modern football.  World&#8217;s getting smaller, and all that jazz.  Doesn&#8217;t help that I&#8217;ve been re-reading a lot about Superga recently; when clubs <i>were</i> pretty much wholly made up of nationals.</p>
<p>I dunno, it just makes me a little sad, I suppose.  Mind you, not enough to send Kaka/Pato/Gourcuff/Seedorf back whence they came&#8230; ;)</p>
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		<title>By: MAD</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25272</link>
		<dc:creator>MAD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 18:16:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25272</guid>
		<description>Ruby: Eeeeeer, yes? Inter is an Italian team... I mean they play in Italy (I THINK Milan is in Italy...:)) One of the &quot;rebels&quot; who split from the English ex-pat cabal who began AC Milan is an Italian... The stadium that they play in is named after an Italian who played for Inter... Inter seems to be covered in all the Italian dailies... Are you seriously trying to gauge the level of Italian-ness of a football team? I mean they are celebrating the 100th year of their existence this year...er in Milan, Italy, right? :)

By the way, (and this is a little beside the point, but pertinent in a funny way) many Italians feel that the other half of the peninsula, geographically of course, aren&#039;t exactly Italians anyway. The north half view the south half as, shall we say, a little slow and rural. The southern half thinks the northerners are a bunch of city dwelling, blonde German half-breeds who actually speak &quot;Italian&quot; anyway. So, whose an Italian exactly?

If YOU feel that international players shouldn&#039;t make up an entire squad that&#039;s great, and you have every right to do so. But if you do, feel free to also be upset that the fans of Inter, the club officials and probably the players may not agree with you. 

In this case I am not sympathetic. Inter, like all teams have the obligation to their fans to field the best team that are able. If, in this case it requires all interenational players on the team, so be it. I have the luxury and the good sense, I think although it was rough for a while there, to only root for those teams that will do what they can to make the best team possible. Some teams just stive to save money and dump salary when they can. Some teams have a strict budget and will not go one euro over. Some teams will try to do everything they can, legally. Most of the time, I feel that team is Inter.

Others can gripe and moan, but the bottem line is that it works. And that is a hallmark of Serie A and Italian football.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ruby: Eeeeeer, yes? Inter is an Italian team&#8230; I mean they play in Italy (I THINK Milan is in Italy&#8230;:)) One of the &#8220;rebels&#8221; who split from the English ex-pat cabal who began AC Milan is an Italian&#8230; The stadium that they play in is named after an Italian who played for Inter&#8230; Inter seems to be covered in all the Italian dailies&#8230; Are you seriously trying to gauge the level of Italian-ness of a football team? I mean they are celebrating the 100th year of their existence this year&#8230;er in Milan, Italy, right? :)</p>
<p>By the way, (and this is a little beside the point, but pertinent in a funny way) many Italians feel that the other half of the peninsula, geographically of course, aren&#8217;t exactly Italians anyway. The north half view the south half as, shall we say, a little slow and rural. The southern half thinks the northerners are a bunch of city dwelling, blonde German half-breeds who actually speak &#8220;Italian&#8221; anyway. So, whose an Italian exactly?</p>
<p>If YOU feel that international players shouldn&#8217;t make up an entire squad that&#8217;s great, and you have every right to do so. But if you do, feel free to also be upset that the fans of Inter, the club officials and probably the players may not agree with you. </p>
<p>In this case I am not sympathetic. Inter, like all teams have the obligation to their fans to field the best team that are able. If, in this case it requires all interenational players on the team, so be it. I have the luxury and the good sense, I think although it was rough for a while there, to only root for those teams that will do what they can to make the best team possible. Some teams just stive to save money and dump salary when they can. Some teams have a strict budget and will not go one euro over. Some teams will try to do everything they can, legally. Most of the time, I feel that team is Inter.</p>
<p>Others can gripe and moan, but the bottem line is that it works. And that is a hallmark of Serie A and Italian football.</p>
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		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25264</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 16:35:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25264</guid>
		<description>MAD, not my back comments.

And if you did, you&#039;d have fewer questions to ask and more answers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MAD, not my back comments.</p>
<p>And if you did, you&#8217;d have fewer questions to ask and more answers.</p>
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		<title>By: Ruby</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25254</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 16:13:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25254</guid>
		<description>MAD, &#039;Inter is an Italian team&#039;?  But my point is, that if there are NO Italians in the outfield there&#039;s a bit of a blur over how Italian that team is, surely?

International players &lt;i&gt;do&lt;/i&gt; make a team stronger, I just feel that they should not make up the entire squad...

(And yes, I do moan just as much about the lack of English players in English teams.  I have been brought up in an Arsenal-loving family, and am frequently having this same discussion with my father *grin*)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MAD, &#8216;Inter is an Italian team&#8217;?  But my point is, that if there are NO Italians in the outfield there&#8217;s a bit of a blur over how Italian that team is, surely?</p>
<p>International players <i>do</i> make a team stronger, I just feel that they should not make up the entire squad&#8230;</p>
<p>(And yes, I do moan just as much about the lack of English players in English teams.  I have been brought up in an Arsenal-loving family, and am frequently having this same discussion with my father *grin*)</p>
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		<title>By: MAD</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25248</link>
		<dc:creator>MAD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 14:47:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25248</guid>
		<description>&quot;Well, MAD, then maybe you should spend more time reading back comments than figuring out what words to capitalize.&quot;

Why should I? You have nothing but scorn for my team, the way Serie A does business and readers who have recently just found this place, apparently. Why should I subject myself to the negativity?

No, I think I&#039;ll just capitalize as I feel necessary and if YOU don&#039;t like it, you can ban me if you want. Just for the record, it doesn&#039;t take me very long to figure out which words to capitalize. As a means of comparison, it takes me about as long as it takes me to read a bunch of tripe</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Well, MAD, then maybe you should spend more time reading back comments than figuring out what words to capitalize.&#8221;</p>
<p>Why should I? You have nothing but scorn for my team, the way Serie A does business and readers who have recently just found this place, apparently. Why should I subject myself to the negativity?</p>
<p>No, I think I&#8217;ll just capitalize as I feel necessary and if YOU don&#8217;t like it, you can ban me if you want. Just for the record, it doesn&#8217;t take me very long to figure out which words to capitalize. As a means of comparison, it takes me about as long as it takes me to read a bunch of tripe</p>
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		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25246</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 13:59:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25246</guid>
		<description>Well, MAD, then maybe you should spend more time reading back comments than figuring out what words to capitalize.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, MAD, then maybe you should spend more time reading back comments than figuring out what words to capitalize.</p>
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		<title>By: roswitha</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25240</link>
		<dc:creator>roswitha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 13:13:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25240</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s a matter of balance. Inter&#039;s philosophy has always been more egalitarian and cash-happy, so for a long time they were the Real to Milan&#039;s local, class-bound Atleti [Funny how the trophy cabinet doesn&#039;t reflect that at all, fnar fnar]. I don&#039;t know what to think about their dedicated pursuit of foreign talent at the expense of homegrown players - beyond that the first is good but the second is bad - but for me, it means a lot that they have the sort of pulling power and insane, galactic outlook that contributes to the league&#039;s marketability. I&#039;m not expressing this very well, I know, but Serie A needs its Inter as much [but never more] than it needs its Fiorentina. 

I like the fact that if, tomorrow, Platini&#039;s mad rules came in to force and foreign players were severely limited in Europe, Serie A would be the least badly hit of all the top three. Italy has a fantastic youth program that has proven very tough to break down in the face of evil foreign $$$, and that looks set to continue. They&#039;ll win another World Cup before England get their second.

I do think both Inter and Milan have extremely dumb youth programs, and that needs to change yesterday. 

Also, completely agree that this is not the Derby dell&#039; Italia. The Derby dell&#039; Italia is played between two teams that have never been relegated below Serie A in their entire history, and tonight Inter are playing against a promoted side.

Kill them, Zlatan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s a matter of balance. Inter&#8217;s philosophy has always been more egalitarian and cash-happy, so for a long time they were the Real to Milan&#8217;s local, class-bound Atleti [Funny how the trophy cabinet doesn't reflect that at all, fnar fnar]. I don&#8217;t know what to think about their dedicated pursuit of foreign talent at the expense of homegrown players &#8211; beyond that the first is good but the second is bad &#8211; but for me, it means a lot that they have the sort of pulling power and insane, galactic outlook that contributes to the league&#8217;s marketability. I&#8217;m not expressing this very well, I know, but Serie A needs its Inter as much [but never more] than it needs its Fiorentina. </p>
<p>I like the fact that if, tomorrow, Platini&#8217;s mad rules came in to force and foreign players were severely limited in Europe, Serie A would be the least badly hit of all the top three. Italy has a fantastic youth program that has proven very tough to break down in the face of evil foreign $$$, and that looks set to continue. They&#8217;ll win another World Cup before England get their second.</p>
<p>I do think both Inter and Milan have extremely dumb youth programs, and that needs to change yesterday. </p>
<p>Also, completely agree that this is not the Derby dell&#8217; Italia. The Derby dell&#8217; Italia is played between two teams that have never been relegated below Serie A in their entire history, and tonight Inter are playing against a promoted side.</p>
<p>Kill them, Zlatan.</p>
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		<title>By: MAD</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25218</link>
		<dc:creator>MAD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 09:13:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25218</guid>
		<description>Ruby: If you want to count this last WC team, you have to count them all, all the way back to the first one. I think you will find that Inter is more than represented. I am  not denying the number of any other team to be represented. I am just saying that for a team that is sooooooooo under-represented by Italians we had one player for sure ( I am blanking on Grosso, I think he belonged to Inter but was loaned out the season of the WC)

Chris: &quot;I like the 4-5 on the field at all times&quot;

I am still unclear why YOU get to decide how many (if any) internationals get to play for anyone. What is the problem? Is it because the team you follow hasn&#039;t the budget of Inter and you are upset that they get to field competative teams (just fishing here, I have no idea which team you follow)?

&quot;As far as what it would take for me to see this as less of a black eye on the league, I really don’t know&quot;

International players are not a black eye on the league, at least not to me. CHEATING is a black eye on the league. International players make the league stronger, in my opinion.

&quot;But to have the Derby d’Italia with one team having zero Italians on the outfield roster is ludicrous&quot;

The derby is between two TEAMS not twenty players. YOU may find this ludicrous but I do not. Inter is an Italian team and has been for 100 years. They play in an Italian League and have for 100 years. The actual make-up of the players isn&#039;t going to change that.

Do you gripe about how the Green Bay Packers do not actually have anyone who is from Green Bay? Or that there is only one player for the Dallas Cowboys who is from Dallas? I doubt it. Do you whine that the Yankees and Red Sox rarely carry players from their own system? I suspect that the issue here isn&#039;t national pride, eh, &quot;Chris&quot; (and yet somehow not Cris...) but jealousy that your team can&#039;t pay for the internationals, perhaps?

Oh, by the way, it seems to be working fine for them and the league...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ruby: If you want to count this last WC team, you have to count them all, all the way back to the first one. I think you will find that Inter is more than represented. I am  not denying the number of any other team to be represented. I am just saying that for a team that is sooooooooo under-represented by Italians we had one player for sure ( I am blanking on Grosso, I think he belonged to Inter but was loaned out the season of the WC)</p>
<p>Chris: &#8220;I like the 4-5 on the field at all times&#8221;</p>
<p>I am still unclear why YOU get to decide how many (if any) internationals get to play for anyone. What is the problem? Is it because the team you follow hasn&#8217;t the budget of Inter and you are upset that they get to field competative teams (just fishing here, I have no idea which team you follow)?</p>
<p>&#8220;As far as what it would take for me to see this as less of a black eye on the league, I really don’t know&#8221;</p>
<p>International players are not a black eye on the league, at least not to me. CHEATING is a black eye on the league. International players make the league stronger, in my opinion.</p>
<p>&#8220;But to have the Derby d’Italia with one team having zero Italians on the outfield roster is ludicrous&#8221;</p>
<p>The derby is between two TEAMS not twenty players. YOU may find this ludicrous but I do not. Inter is an Italian team and has been for 100 years. They play in an Italian League and have for 100 years. The actual make-up of the players isn&#8217;t going to change that.</p>
<p>Do you gripe about how the Green Bay Packers do not actually have anyone who is from Green Bay? Or that there is only one player for the Dallas Cowboys who is from Dallas? I doubt it. Do you whine that the Yankees and Red Sox rarely carry players from their own system? I suspect that the issue here isn&#8217;t national pride, eh, &#8220;Chris&#8221; (and yet somehow not Cris&#8230;) but jealousy that your team can&#8217;t pay for the internationals, perhaps?</p>
<p>Oh, by the way, it seems to be working fine for them and the league&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25150</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Nov 2007 23:24:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25150</guid>
		<description>&quot;Mancini repeatedly says (in spite of your attempts at obscuring his comments), the teams with good Italian players don’t want to sell them.&quot;

Last time I checked, they have a youth team - and a good one (Chivu-Barzagli aside - which is a relevant example since Andrea was the alternative, but whatever - sell Andreolli? The top young CB in the boot when all it took was a couple extra million?). And Juve, Milan, Roma and Fiorentina seem to acquire good Italian players - and he can outbid all of them. Like I said, this is all a cop out. Nothing more. I understand Moratti isn&#039;t bright enough to realize most of this. But someone in that organization must be.

The answer has been proposed, and is simple: minimum requirement for nationals. I like the 4-5 on the field at all times, but that&#039;d be difficult to implement. As far as what it would take for me to see this as less of a black eye on the league, I really don&#039;t know. Maybe 3? But to have the Derby d&#039;Italia with one team having zero Italians on the outfield roster is ludicrous.

And Martha, I think you&#039;re going to have to give Fiorentina a few more years before deciding whether or not this youth, youth, youth thing is working. It&#039;s far too early in the process to crown them as a model organization. (Especially when last year they were led by Toni, Mutu, Jorgensen, Liverani, Dainelli, Ujfalusi and Frey - all far from babies. They had a couple, but they were by no means a &quot;youth&quot; team.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Mancini repeatedly says (in spite of your attempts at obscuring his comments), the teams with good Italian players don’t want to sell them.&#8221;</p>
<p>Last time I checked, they have a youth team &#8211; and a good one (Chivu-Barzagli aside &#8211; which is a relevant example since Andrea was the alternative, but whatever &#8211; sell Andreolli? The top young CB in the boot when all it took was a couple extra million?). And Juve, Milan, Roma and Fiorentina seem to acquire good Italian players &#8211; and he can outbid all of them. Like I said, this is all a cop out. Nothing more. I understand Moratti isn&#8217;t bright enough to realize most of this. But someone in that organization must be.</p>
<p>The answer has been proposed, and is simple: minimum requirement for nationals. I like the 4-5 on the field at all times, but that&#8217;d be difficult to implement. As far as what it would take for me to see this as less of a black eye on the league, I really don&#8217;t know. Maybe 3? But to have the Derby d&#8217;Italia with one team having zero Italians on the outfield roster is ludicrous.</p>
<p>And Martha, I think you&#8217;re going to have to give Fiorentina a few more years before deciding whether or not this youth, youth, youth thing is working. It&#8217;s far too early in the process to crown them as a model organization. (Especially when last year they were led by Toni, Mutu, Jorgensen, Liverani, Dainelli, Ujfalusi and Frey &#8211; all far from babies. They had a couple, but they were by no means a &#8220;youth&#8221; team.)</p>
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		<title>By: Ruby</title>
		<link>http://italy.theoffside.com/serie-a/zlatan-meanwhile-is-saying-at-least-vaguely-nice-things.html#comment-25147</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Nov 2007 22:47:12 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>tmc, to answer your &#039;how many&#039; question; yes, I do  think there should be a clear-cut arrangement.  For me, I think there should be at least three nationals in a starting line-up.  In an ideal world I&#039;d go for four or five, but realise that may be a little idealistic.  

And it&#039;s not just about teams I don&#039;t like, I promise.  I hate it just as much in my own team *grin*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tmc, to answer your &#8216;how many&#8217; question; yes, I do  think there should be a clear-cut arrangement.  For me, I think there should be at least three nationals in a starting line-up.  In an ideal world I&#8217;d go for four or five, but realise that may be a little idealistic.  </p>
<p>And it&#8217;s not just about teams I don&#8217;t like, I promise.  I hate it just as much in my own team *grin*</p>
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